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Gay Language

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Feral:
My memory (which betrays me more times than I would like) insisted that I had seen the Esperanto word "geja" in print already. Upon searching a bit I find that indeed, the adjective "geja" is in use in Esperanto to refer to homosexuals. Naturally, one automatically infers the existance of the root "gej-" which leads us to a great many words (some of which are difficult to grasp -- the adverb "geje," for instance).


--- Quote ---This is all fine, as long as a supplementary dictionary is issued regularly.
--- End quote ---

LOL

The Esperantists are rather chauvinist about the "purity" of their language. Perhaps Idists are as well, perhaps not. Some enquiry into what words already exist (or can be reasonably formed) is certainly called for, but I was not thinking of asking anyone's permission to speak my mind -- in Esperanto, Ido, or any other language. Alas, language is a flexible thing, and it mutates quite rapidly when it falls from the tongues of gays. Just this evening the Ninja Monkey and I were venting about the recent unfavorable marriage decision in the UK, and the phrase "damn frajuli" popped right out. "Spawners" indeed. Dictionaries are all well and good -- they serve to catch up people who have not been paying attention. This year the folks at the Oxford English Dictionary have decided that "Google" is a verb. Well, of course it is! I have been googling things for about three years now. In due course the compilers of dictionaries may even come to recognize the mystic art of google-fu. It is usage and usage alone that propels new words into a language.

The important thing is to stop being chained by heterosexual vocabularies. They are just words. We must seize control of our own mouths and our own thoughts.

Mogul:

--- Quote from: Feral on Sat, Jul 29, 2006, 06:15 ---However, the number of people who speak Esperanto is quite irrelevant to its usefulness as a national language. There are several problems with the language, as it's proponents have long been aware. Ido addresses all of these difficulties. It can even be typed on a perfectly ordinary keyboard -- a definite bonus. I could wholeheartedly endorse Ido as well.
--- End quote ---

Esperanto is, of course, a fine language, but it incorporated several "bugs" which are so typical for every alpha-version, and which make the language unnecessary complicated - a severe drawback for a language designed for the purpose of simplicity and logic. Advantageously, IDO has overcome these few mistakes of its predecessor and has become a really fine language. It sounds really nice, and, most important, it has simple and very logical grammar -- as simple as possible, as complex as necessary -- and a compact pool of word roots. It is really much easier to learn than English (or any other language I know), thus being very suitable for beginners to achieve the necessary skills in relatively short time. If gay people should decide to adopt an auxiliary language, IDO would be probably the best choice.


--- Quote from: Feral on Sat, Jul 29, 2006, 06:15 ---But the problem of language extends deeper for gay people than the multiplicity of languages spoken on Earth. That problem is simple to solve: we all agree to learn some alternative. *POOF* Problem gone. The deeper problem remains -- we have no words.
The word 'husband' does not correctly characterize Ninja_monkey's status. Nor does 'marriage' properly describe the relationship we have maintained these past 20 years. They are analogs -- we force them to serve, and then explain. A mere generation ago the gay people popularized the word 'gay' to name ourselves because we lacked a suitable word. 'Schwule' was adopted for much the same reason.

--- End quote ---

Very true - sometimes thing do not have their proper name and one must either create new words or fill the existing ones with new contents. Both ways are justified. What words are best suitable to describe our everyday realities, is entirely up to us - and it is not like this that our people lack creativity. :P The English word "marriage" describes an institution which anyway does not have the same meaning in all parts oof the world - the spectrum goes from the catholic "until the death separates you" to an informal tribal rituals in "primitive" societies. Shall the gays adopt this institution under their own souvereignity, it will be most certainly very different from other countries. Whatever words there will be choosen, the real innovation will be to create various institutions which suit best the demands of the gay people.

Some words in IDO:


* marriage = mariajo
* civil marriage = civila mariajo
* spouse = spozo
* husband = spozulo
* wife = spozino
* unmarried quasi-spouse = konkubo (n)
* unmarried quasi-spouse = konkubulo (m)
* unmarried quasi-spouse = konkubino (f)
* harem = haremo
* lover = amanto (n)
* lover = amantulo (m)
* lover = amantino (f)
* beloved = amato (n)
* prostitute = putano (n)  ::)
* child = puero (n)
* homosexual person = homeosexualo (n)
* cheerful = gaya
* gay person = gayo (not in the dictionary, but gramatically correct)  :L
* clan = klano
The specifically male or female form can be shaped by inserting -ul- or -in- right before the final -o in case of necessety, but out of convenience the neutral form probably will be used mostly (also it sounds much smoother). The problem of very poor vocabulary especially for gay issues is striking, but we shall not forget that this is not yet a "finished" language, there is certainly space for innovation.


--- Quote from: Feral on Sat, Jul 29, 2006, 06:15 ---Language shapes the way we think, and therefore the way we act in the world. No matter what language we speak now or choose to speak in the future, we shall lack important words that describe us, who we are, the things we do, and the things we dream of. [..] If we were to adopt an auxiliary language (an idea which has considerable merit), we would still face the task of modifying and amending that language to express gay thoughts. We face that task even if we do not adopt such a language.

--- End quote ---


The standard IDO-vocabulary is suitable for administrative purposes, but it indeed fails entirely to cover the reality of gay people. One established as a living language, IDO (at least our version of it) will be permanently being adjusted to actual realities of the gay population. Therefore it is clear that there will be a necessity to "officially introduce" new word roots to match the language of the people - why not? Once spoken by a considerable number of people in their dayly life, our auxiliary language will inevitably escape its close academic corset and will develope on its own, still retaining its excellent grammar. There is little doubt that immigrants from different countries will unconsciously "smuggle" a word or two from their native languages into the general use, therefore establishing one or more slangs attached to the official language. It is well possible, that "schwuchtelo", "chickeno" and "mariposo" will peacefully co-exist in the gay version of IDO. This is all fine, as long as a supplementary dictionary is issued regularly.

Parts of the the gay slang vocabulary can be adopted, as long as it does not collide with the standard vocabulary. For example, butch.in.o can be easily adopted for the "masculine lesbian", whereas the kamp.o for an "effeminate person" can be confused with kamp.ey.o ("camp, camp site").

The best way to enlarge the official vocabulary would be probably the systematic approach (which is a good tradition in IDO): we should first make a list of words which appear to be missing to describe our realities, and than contest the various suggestions for each word on this list. It is clear, that not only European languages shall be taken into account, but also Arabic, Asian and African. Cooperation with the various IDO societies shall be established then as soon as possible, probably they will be gaya to play around a little bit with this interesting issue.

Feral:
In another topic Mogul wrote:


--- Quote ---If the Gay State is to secure the cross-border immigration rates as high as the internal migration rates elsewhere, it shall find solutions to help migrants to overcome the above difficulties connected to the language and new legal system. First of all, migrants must quickly learn the country language, because otherwise they will be not able to find an appropriate job corresponding with their professional skills. The ways to solve this problem are either a very simple, easy-to-learn country language (Esperanto, IDO, Basic English) or a very massive deploy of language courses for all and for free. Second, migrants must have chances to get their professional skills recognized or evaluated, and in case of necessity be helped to gain the necessary level.
--- End quote ---

I think this subject warrants a topic of its own.

Language is, of course, an issue for any international movement. The matter came up briefly in the discourse of the Gay Kingdom. While every language has it's partisans, there is much to be said for adopting a separate 'auxiliary' language for ourselves. There are several such languages, and the problem with this sort of discussion is that some clever fellow will invariably suggest Klingon.

The obvious choice is, of course, Esperanto since it is the most commonly spoken language of its type. I have no problem with such an adoption -- my husband and I used to be prone to gossiping quite shamelessly in it. However, the number of people who speak Esperanto is quite irrelevant to its usefulness as a national language. There are several problems with the language, as it's proponents have long been aware. Ido addresses all of these difficulties. It can even be typed on a perfectly ordinary keyboard -- a definite bonus. I could wholeheartedly endorse Ido as well.

But the problem of language extends deeper for gay people than the multiplicity of languages spoken on Earth. That problem is simple to solve: we all agree to learn some alternative. *POOF* Problem gone. The deeper problem remains -- we have no words.

The word 'husband' does not correctly characterize Ninja_monkey's status. Nor does 'marriage' properly describe the relationship we have maintained these past 20 years. They are analogs -- we force them to serve, and then explain. A mere generation ago the gay people popularized the word 'gay' to name ourselves because we lacked a suitable word. 'Schwule' was adopted for much the same reason.

Esperanto (and Ido, which shares the bulk of it's vocabulary) is a fine language for talking about heterosexuals. All languages are fine languages for talking about heterosexuals. It is not our intention to spend all of our time talking about them; it is high time we talked a bit more about ourselves. Language shapes the way we think, and therefore the way we act in the world. No matter what language we speak now or choose to speak in the future, we shall lack important words that describe us, who we are, the things we do, and the things we dream of. There was a time when (in English at least) gays adopted a body of slang in the form of Polari to make up for some of these deficits.

If we were to adopt an auxiliary language (an idea which has considerable merit), we would still face the task of modifying and amending that language to express gay thoughts. We face that task even if we do not adopt such a language.

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