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"Queer Nation" Manifest from 1991

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Mogul:
To preserve the original issue of this topic, some replies were split off and merged to the thread Gay Realpolitiks.

8[

K6:

--- Quote from: Feral on Thu, Apr 27, 2006, 19:41 ---During the brief blossoming of Queer Nation I was unavoidably distracted by my charming (and totally hot) new husband, so I experienced their activities only as part of the background noise of politics at the time. They had two chief faults (which may be inter-related). Foremost was their Utopian organizational model--all accounts agree that their comparatively spontaneous protest actions were both exhilarating and effective, but that their meetings were chaotic, seemingly endless, and ultimately useless. Second, they arose, as did most gay movements, out of the most Leftist streams of political thought in the US. With the collapse of the Berlin Wall, so also collapsed any hope for the Left or it's ideologies in the United States. The populace here simply no longer wants to hear the thoughts of "the losers." That the ideas may well be fundamentally in error also enters into the picture.

--- End quote ---

The political left was traditionnally an ally of ours.Of course,and by a flaw of human nature which is not fundamentaly socialistic,the left took advantage of us and exploited our human ressources for its own and sole ends,which were heterosexual.And we were partly to blame for this,for
we had forgot to deal with heterosexuals - leftists as much as they want - as foreigners.We didn`t dealth with them on the basis and procedures
- some of them precautionary - of political independence.We had forgotten who they were and who we were,two sets of entirely different earthly interests which no leftist theory or dream can make identical or equivalent.

K6

K6:

--- Quote from: Mogul on Fri, Apr 28, 2006, 02:21 ---Marxism was only one part of the entire socialist spectrum, and like it s, some ideas were definitely wrong, and some seem right. Any political movement is well-advised to pick out usefull suggestions and build them into its own concept. Gay/queer nationalism e.g. might include the notion of basic social standards and adequate wages, as well as good medical support for all. There is a difference between the economical and social organization of a society - which meens, a society with market economy very well is free to establish social welfare state.

--- End quote ---

What is to be nationalized in a country of ours is to be decided solely on the basis of our own interest.Not based upon some theoretical universal interest for which no one would move to another country let alone stake his life,like the interest embodied in marxism.If we are to remain politically independent,our demography - notably at the level of the replacement of our human ressources - is to be entirely nationalized.As for economy,where a system of private enterprise serves society as everyone else does,let there be a sector of private enterprise.Where the system of private enterprise does not serve society,where especially it refuses to do so,let`s have along with State intervention some measure of socialism.

K6

Mogul:

--- Quote from: K6 on Thu, Apr 27, 2006, 13:29 ---[..] The aims and illusions of marxism are of no interest to us.Its tactical methods,however,may be of use and thus worth being studied.They should form part of the curriculum of political studies of any consequent gay separatist.If a gay secession leads to some results with vague ressemblences with socialism,like a demography under State control unlike organized heterosexual societies,it will be only incidental and not part of any strategic aim of ours. [..]
--- End quote ---

Marxism was only one part of the entire socialist spectrum, and like it s, some ideas were definitely wrong, and some seem right. Any political movement is well-advised to pick out usefull suggestions and build them into its own concept. Gay/queer nationalism e.g. might include the notion of basic social standards and adequate wages, as well as good medical support for all. There is a difference between the economical and social organization of a society - which meens, a society with market economy very well is free to establish social welfare state.


--- Quote from: K6 on Thu, Apr 27, 2006, 13:29 ---[..] Our headackes will come from such ideologies like islam,fundamentalist christianism,or secular and stateless economic systems like neo-liberalism,which all seek in a way or another the abolition of the nation-State. [..]
--- End quote ---

The nationalist's world view is based on the assumption, that a people can best develope (both culturally and economically) in a nation-state on its own. Naturally, any ambitions from other movements/entities to abolish the nation-state are contrary to the ideology of nationalism. Unlike it is commonly believed, any international cooperation and supranational structures do not contradict the idea of a nation-state - on contrary, the nation-state is the basis of all such activities! Of course, one may rightfully question the real role of the nation-state in a world where certain concerns have larger budget than the most states members of the UN. Nevertheless, even the richest corporation may be disowned by any particular state - money is nothingl against a group of resolute men with AK-47.


--- Quote from: Feral on Thu, Apr 27, 2006, 19:41 ---[..] While one could point to any number of "sparks," Queer Nation was the spark that ignited gay identity politics, and as such, this spark is hardly extinct. Nationalism is, I think, identity politics taken to it's greatest (or purest) extent. [..]
--- End quote ---

Whereas e.g. Michael Denneny raised the issue of gay identity for an individual, Queer Nation raised the issue of gay/queer identity for us as a collectivum. Others have called later for a gay/queer state - I see here just stages (important ones!) of the same process - discovering our identity as a people. Consequently, the vital and worthy existence of our people is the ultimate purpose of gay/queer nationalism.

The failure to establish a true nation can not be lasted upon the the queer nationals alone. A nation is based on local communities, whos leaders must unquestioned support national institutions. Our main problem is that we barely have organized local communities - here we must start. The impact of Queer Nation on the gay/queer identity was indeed very valuable.

P.S. An idea does not necessarily require immediate organisatory structures to change the world - the idea itself and its implementation are quite different pairs of shoes. Once an elaborately expressed idea is set free into the wide world, it takes its place in the hearts and minds of the people - who might or might not put it into realization.

Feral:

--- Quote --- Queer Nation was one spark of gay national movement - a spark which has unfortunately become extinct. So what? While setting a fire, many strikes on the ignition stone are required. As far as I can judge from the limited sources, that early "Queer Nationals" were indeed not "nationalists" in the literally meaning of the word (this is rightfully noted in this article by Paul Treanor [chapter 6.13]). It seems, the guys were not that far with their identity as a people - or the time was not come yet.
 
--- End quote ---

During the brief blossoming of Queer Nation I was unavoidably distracted by my charming (and totally hot) new husband, so I experienced their activities only as part of the background noise of politics at the time. They had two chief faults (which may be inter-related). Foremost was their Utopian organizational model--all accounts agree that their comparatively spontaneous protest actions were both exhilarating and effective, but that their meetings were chaotic, seemingly endless, and ultimately useless. Second, they arose, as did most gay movements, out of the most Leftist streams of political thought in the US. With the collapse of the Berlin Wall, so also collapsed any hope for the Left or it's ideologies in the United States. The populace here simply no longer wants to hear the thoughts of "the losers." That the ideas may well be fundamentally in error also enters into the picture.

Although its existence was brief, Queer Nation had a profound impact. The slogan "We're here, we're queer, get used to it" is known by almost everyone, even if it's source is not. It even appears on the Simpsons cartoon on occasion. While one could point to any number of "sparks," Queer Nation was the spark that ignited gay identity politics, and as such, this spark is hardly extinct. Nationalism is, I think, identity politics taken to it's greatest (or purest) extent. Queer Nation used the word "nation," and for many young men like myself, that usage prompted the realization that we ARE a nation, even if that realization was at odds with the stated aims of Queer Nation and the Left at the time.

I find two things in Queer Nation's effects: a great deal of political thought that pertained only to the times and a (I think) misguided urge to Socialist revolution, and a remarkable and sudden up-swell of passion for their identity. Much of what they said was entirely true, even if they themselves missed the point. "There is nothing about identity politics that necessarily leads to activism," says Mr. Sears, and he is right, so long as he is discussing Socialist activism (as he surely is). Identity politics and gay nationalism serve neither the left nor the right--it is no surprise that existing political parties have little use for it. What faces us is the question of who we are and what we will become--there is no legitimate role for "others" in these discussions.

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